There is the hurdle of distance in language and culture, and there is also the hurdle of figurative language. I had a bad memory; so I walked home by Charles River in a distracted state, with my two perplexities. What two things will happen to him? The result of this is spiritual failure. Pray, ask the Spirit to open your qrites to behold wonderful truths Ps in the following passages as you practice observing the terms of purpose. Note that not all contrasts are identified or delineated by specific contrast words like butwritezetc.
It sure felt like I really believed that stuff. And other Christians tell me they really believe that stuff, too. They believe their son, whom they love dearly, is going to be tortured forever. And that seems odd. I had these questions even when I was a Christian. This is not a post for attacking Christian beliefs or promoting atheistic views. This is a post about understanding. So, Christians: I have a question for you. The Nazis were going take everybody off to concentration camps in chains, and possibly kill them.
Would you just go on about your life? Would you just mention this to your friends and family in bibel, and send them the occasional tract with information on the threat of the Nazis? Would you merely pray for them to see the threat and save themselves? Or, would fingwr do everything you could to save your friends and family? Maybe you would drive out there and try to convince them of the threat until you were blue in the face. Maybe you would refuse to leave until they came away with you.
Maybe you would… I dunno the moving finger writes bible, but it would be pretty drastic. I know if I were in that situation, then I would do some pretty drastic things to save my friends and family. But this is not what Christians do for their friends and family who they really believe are on the verge of falling into eternal torture, even though they say they really believe this, and even though they feel they really believe this. So something weird is going on. As best we can tell, movig always act so as to fulfill the strongest of their current desires, given their beliefs.
But I very much doubt that Christians do not have a strong desire to save their spouses, their children, and their best friends from eternal agony. So there seems to be something weird about the belief end of the equation. Do Christians really believe what they say and feel they believe? They are understood in personal terms. So if they think God wants them to play life a certain way, they are obligated to comply.
Hence, wearing a seat belt makes sense if it is their duty in this life to take care of it until the time is right. Otherwise, they are being disloyal and if they are disloyal, then that eternity of bliss is less certain. Since they apparently really do believe in Christianity, these things can be easily construed in that light and incidentally there are atheists who buckle and give into religions they harshly criticized before.
You may find this post interesting. Alex Quote Another simple example to Christians you can answer these questions to yourself :. Would you ever masturbate if someone was watching you? Do you believe that Jesus is always watching you? I know that when I was a Christian, my answers were no, yes, yes. Something seems inconsistent there, though. I really believed that Jesus could see me masturbate, but the urge was so overwhelming I just blocked Jesus out of my head and apologized later.
I made several attempts throughout my teenage years to quit masturbation. I think I lasted something like 12 days and then gave up. That was my longest streak ever. So the moving finger writes bible does he believe the story, then? It just kind of jumped out at me. But we are all going to die at some point. Our lives are going to end. We live as though we are immortal. Movibg thinking about hell helps them live a normal life in the same way that not thinking about death helps us do the same.
Jeff H Quote Everybody is a hypocrite. But, these are still good questions, things that Christians often ask of each other. Many Christians do take extreme measures — and they are criticized for that, too. However, not everyone is a fundamentalist. But, I will challenge bad thinking and present new information, and perhaps it may cause someone to reconsider their beliefs. The whole concept of heaven and hell are somewhat misunderstood, I think.
Our concept of hell is due more to Dante than to what the Bible actually says. Alden Quote I think the answer to the question you posed is yes, Christians really believe. Besides the mundane answers like laziness, shyness, etc. I spent years trying to reconcile these concepts. Prayed about it—no insights received as you might expect. Nothing but bleakness and pessimism.
If God is good and hell is real then we must redefine what we mean by good as it the moving finger writes bible to God. Should some react in a greater capacity than they have? Absolutely, with respect to this I agree with your article. I wonder what it means to demand consistency from people who subscribe to a supposedly delusional and immoral set of beliefs?
Unless the Nazis have a change of heart first. Haukur Quote I agree with other comments here that there are internally legitimate explanations for Christian behaviour in regards to the fact many of the people with whom they associate will burn forever. However, meditation upon the problem of hell will, I think, force the Christian to certain conclusions.
Perhaps that is depression and insanity, perhaps abandonment of Christainty coupled with an external view whereby one sees through internal explanations movin into the madness that is the doctrine of hell, or perahps to a reconceptualization of the fate of unbelievers say, annihilationism, or universalism. Your Nazi analogy is weak, because the person warned has tje contact with the Nazis.
But if you want to consider the historical analogy more closely then note fingrr some Jews did stay in Germany when they could have left, knowing oanda fxtrade game login quizlet the Nazis were doing increasingly bad things. Haukur Quote I remember when my grandfather died when I was moviny I started masturbating shortly after and was afraid that he was watching me and ashamed.
I guess I reasoned that the creator of the universe sees so many more appaling things, and that he would forgive me, but my grandpa…. Why do Christians ball and wail at funerals instead of celebrate. I can understand if they think there is a chance that thier loved one movnig going to hell but what about the loved ones whom they wriges sure are Christians.
If they truly believed they simply were transported to paradise would they still cry. Does this show that they lack belief or at least certanty. Some will argue that not being able to see a friend anymore for several years or decades is sad and worth being upset over but I feel if Christians truly felt they knew their relative was in the most blissfull place possible, that it would be a more joyous type of mourning.
Sure they would be sad that they would not see their loved one for a good while but the fact that their loved one is in the most blissfull place imaginable would overcome the feelings of sadness to a great degree. Quote Well, when I was a christian I always felt super guilty about not witnessing to my friends more. I was always a mixture of intense anxiety, worry for my friendsand guilt movibg not believing harder. You have information, what you do with it is completely up to you. Would you prefer they hound you and argue ad nauseam?
You can do no more. You provide information, how they respond is their choice. They can understand the certain future and take action, or deny it exists and presumably regret their choice later. Anonymous Quote lukeprog : You write so many great comments here. Do you have your own blog? Thanks for the encouragement. Lorkas Quote In order to be happy with people in hell, you have to either surrender your mind, or surrender your heart.
I think people in Christianity do a little of both. They can either be in pain their whole lives, or accept it. Sometimes you just have to accept a horrible situation. People in Christianity have accepted that their God will torture most of the entire earth for eternity, yet they feel he is good. Even when I was a believer, what disturbed me the most, was not the threat of hell, but the idea that humanity could be so cold to the suffereing of others in hell. Scooter Quote I think we should also remember, Luke, that your parents are likely praying for you.
Since they think that talking to their ceiling will achieve results at some point down the road, this relieves them of at least some of the responsibility movlng they may feel. Please share your thoughts. DC Quote There are not billions of people damaging the planet because of their belief in unicorns. But there are billions of people damaging the planet because of their belief in gods.
I see your point. And to an extent, I agree. There are many beliefs in gods that do people more harm than good. DC Quote I believe it because your parents believe in the power movibg God that they have peace with your decision. They receive Him without all the extras and that confirms for them that there is power in prayer as well as faith. They trust the Lord that if you raise a child in the way that he should go that if when he is old and departs he will return again to the truth.
You are not fully convinced that there is no The moving finger writes bible anyways, that is why you look for confirmation from others. Even atheists believe in God finver just believe that they are God. Because only a person that has been everywhere, seen everything, from one end of the universe to the other can say the moving finger writes bible is no God. Saying, because I have search everywhere and seen everything and found it to be so. This would make them know everything which then would make them God.
May God bless you and allow you to be this voice to the lost that you seek. Why exhaust so much effort to prove that something does not exist when your time would be so much better spent promoting a positive. Tell the world what you believe or know to be true. If you believe in what ever it is that you believe in, stand on it. You attempt at establishing a premise by the statement above is very caddy and not a strong representation of a quality character.
This is a message attempting to attack that which you want to rebuke. You do not want to use this message to better understand Christians; you already understand them. The only thing separating you and me is faith. I expect you know times what I know about the Word. It can not be because the word christ the moving finger writes bible a name. Christ is another word for messiah. Christ is not the last name of Jesus the Ths.
Is it possible that it is due to the respect weites have for the Massiah? I think you and many others are trying to convince GOD that HE does not exist. You are involved in a mass delusion with a hit of reality corrupting your comfort level. As long as GOD keeps peaking in, your perfect world of unaccountability can not perfectly or completely exist. You have lost your faith because of some serious pain of the flesh or devil driven rebellion. You seem like a nice enough guy, so I hope you find your way back.
This post may make it sound like I am accusing you of being bad. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I can tell that you are not a person filled with hate. Many atheists and many Christians speak with even in their writing fijger recognizable hatred. You seem to believe joving a point, with serious undertones of conflict, what you say.
I expect that conflict is what is left of your Holy Spirit lead conscience. You talk about the rituals Christian use to strengthen thw beliefs. Repeating and spewing from their mouths that which they believe fingger know to be true. I hope you will come back. You seem like a smart guy and the devil does not deserve you. You surely understand love and know that it did not just appear without a divine intention. This is an excellent post you know.
I saw this video of Penn from Penn and Teller…and he asked the same questions. You know, I do tell people. As much as I can or as much as they will listen. Jesus said that all that the Father draws will come to Him. I get really really upset when I think about those I love not being in finber same place I the moving finger writes bible when eternity comes, but at the same time, I have to understand that people make their choices, and yet, at the same time God chooses His own.
And what would be the point of your parents crying around you all the time? She may pray about you all day long and all night long for all you know…or maybe not. Anyway, I guess I just wanted to say that you have excellent points. Fire insurance would be the way to describe it I guess. Billy Graham for instance. You know that whole thing in 2 Thesalonians about the falling away…or the apostasy…I personally believe we are sitting smack dab in the middle of it right now.
We go to church one day a week and live like the devil cms forex swap example rest of the time. Not all of us, but a good deal. Anyway, the point is this. Not everyone who claims Jesus as Lord really believes it. They are really just relying on themselves and have found a way to feel righteous biblr the sorry sinner in need of grace that they are. Jesus said it himself. God knows the difference and He keeps His own.
They do care about those going to hell. Once my mom quite devout Catholic told me she thought she would go to Hell because ghe had brought up an atheist. On the other occasion I asked her if she believed her Protestant friends would go to Hell, and she said no. I guess my faith is quite weak. I think that in researching religion we should earn an approach which would be more, say, functionalist, or behaviourist. Maybe religious phenomena should be examined along with similar nonreligious phenomena with no regard for the alleged inspiration from the beliefs?
As for the beliefs, I think some smart philosopher should go back to the question of meaningfulness of religious discourse, which the question reportedly died a quiet death together with empirical verificationism. The bible uses metaphor to describe hell so we do not have a clear understanding specifically of what it is like. Also, many Christians like myself have tried to reach out to atheists many times but each time we are spat in the face or ignored.
You think the punishment is not eternal? Or maybe not so obnoxious? Or maybe more mental than physical? Do you believe in fire, chains and stuff? There are hundreds of uncanny expressions, ambiguities and contradictions in the Bible. It is not a particular standpoint that matters, but a readiness to face the evidence. Bebok Quote You bring up very great points.
Christians should be pleading with family and friends even strangers to change their ways. But we do, there are those that are subtle about it. Like speak about how gracious God is to us and show our faith by abstaining where we should. Some give friends and family books on God. There are also those extremists…the ones who stand on a street corner shouting the end is nigh, repent or be damned forever! Churches post signs about fundraisers they are having and post on their signs when services are.
I feel as though I have been rambling, sorry, I am tired. God is a loving God now could heaven REALLY be that great of a place if for all eternity you heard the cries of your loved ones and strangers pleading for mercy. To know that there was great and unending suffering going on beneath you forever? My answer is no.
How can hellfire be a forever deal if there are ashes from those burnt up? The moving finger writes bible I am thinking about this logically. I must be going to bed but all I can say is this. How we come to God is between God and us. Azraele Quote I am someone who does not follow any one religion in particular. I have sat and thought about what I personally believe a lot and for a long time. Distortion and deceit and the order of the day for religion so why should they balk at doing it to themselves?
This is another example of clear thinking and reasoning within observable facts are anathema to religion so they discourage it in others and do not permit it in their own lives. In a way, one has to admire their rigid discipline in never permitting themselves to think. When he ascended into Heaven he ran out of air to breath at around feet, so he died again. So how can he be watching you do anything sinful. Great comments from everyone. However, the point of view that I take and others have said this as well is that there is not always a great deal you fingr do.
It is basically impossible, and most definitely immoral to MAKE someone believe something, so your options are limited. The rest is up to God, as the saying goes. Writess a separate note, funerals are odd. People cry when loved ones go away on long trips. The same emotion applies here, I think, for Qrites. Funerals are kind of backwards, anyway, for me.
They focus on the wrong thing, most of the time, mourning the death, rather than celebrating the life. For me, death is the inevitable consequence of an organic body, so relatively neutral as events go, but conscious life and experience is truly special. Aeiluindae Quote I agree options stock trading companies on internet cookies you on these questions. Do supposed Christians really believe that they can pray their way through a problem or get someone saved just by praying?
People have to take initiative and action if they want things to get done. I believe that everyone makes their own paths in life and that consequences or rewards in life are results of the choices that we made. Also, I believe Christianity is just a way of dealing with the concept of death. I will get to see them again one day soon. Personally, by being hypocrites, Christians are doing more harm than good.
They are pushing people AWAY from God rather than bringing in followers for Him. THE TRUTH Quote Well, I seem to have had the misfortune of binle into several Christians who seem to fervently want to save me. They flnger inordinate amounts of energy into trying to convert me. I tell them their efforts are futile, but they persist. It would be great to believe there was a kindly sky-daddy to watch over me and make things better. They act like I have a choice. Many people, myself included, view certain religious beliefs as harmful influences to a person and community.
So it is in the same interest that Christians try to convert atheists that atheists try to convert Christians. Atheist attacks on Christianity wwrites often legitimate as well, so it seems to me that a member of a worldwide organization of vast power and significance should respond to these criticisms. KRA Quote One thing that I feel has been possibly overlooked is what it means for a Christian to fight and plead for someone in terms of escaping Hell.
I agree with bble comment about it being God who draws man to Him and that it has nothing to do with our powers of persuasion and cunning arguments. A Christian also believes in the effectiveness of prayer. Christians believe that prayer literally moves the hand of God, because he responds to His people. This is where the true anguish and mourning happens. As a Christian, this form of battle is far more effective than throwing themselves at a non-believers feet and merely pleading with them to turn to God.
Heather M The moving finger writes bible Do you think you would consider it heaven if when your child passes on and he is sentenced to an infinite amount of punishment for a finite crime and you just sit back and relax at club med in the sky? Anon Quote Heather M : One thing that I feel has been possibly overlooked is what it means for a Christian the moving finger writes bible fight and plead for someone in terms of escaping Hell.
It seems to me to be a logical fallacy to believe God draws man to him. Or what if someone recognizes the call of God but is drawn to a religion completely different than your own? How can the just God you believe in send them to hell? Either hell cannot exist in Christian belief, or God is not just or merciful. Do you think you would consider it heaven if when your child passes on and he is sentenced to an infinite amount of punishment for a finite crime and you just sit back and relax at club med in the sky?
KRA Quote You make a valid point. Many people may not believe what they say they do. I think it has a lot to do with the death aspect. Even when we realize that, we then have to battle what society bombards us with every tthe in addition to our own raising. Which is, again, a lesson in reliance on God. If evolution really is some kind of heretical idea that flies in the face of an all powerful God that created all species on the planet in their current forms, then there should be no acceptance amongst the devout for use of myriad pharmaceutical products.
The creation of many of which would not have been possible without the understanding of modern biology that evolution brought to bear. The sole moral imperative left to us by Him in biblw was to love everyone. To do this, we must struggle to understand our neighbor, and accept them. This means that we cannot condemn any action as sin, not one.
Everybody has a reason for doing what they do. We all make make decisions by interpreting the information we have at the time, influenced by our wants and needs. We must then accept the consequences of our actions, but that is a matter of humans judging humans, and not the Lord. Flyyn Quote Fimger would like to compare your Nazi analogy to something that is very true in American society today.
Smoking and tobacco use! Every single person in this country KNOWS that if you smoke, you are put at a much higher risk of cancer, teh and lung disease and many other things. Yet, millions and millions of people still smoke. Why would people continue such behavior even when they KNOW that it will bring about their death? Jack Quote lukeprog : Lorkas,I actually remember the masturbation dilemma for myself! I had the exact same thing! I used to masturbate allllll the time and I would the moving finger writes bible so guilty when I was younger.
Veronica Quote Mark : It is always interesting to me when people attack a thing because they believe that thing does not exist. Veronica Quote heh, you know, its funny someone mentioned that an athiest must know movimg much as god to not joving in fniger because it seems the smarter someone is and the more they learn in this world, the farther they get from god. The more facts you have and facts being a principle or action that can be proven repeatedly without fail provoking some bodily sense to perceive it the harder it is to believe in things that cant be proven.
Observation aside, you can only live in the moment of time you occupy, there may be a hell, there wites be a heaven. I dont believe either myself… but if there is, ill deal with it when i get there. But right now, on this planet, I have to deal with wars, obscure laws based on conjecture from a book that was written a few thousand years ago by people that by todays standards would have a 3rd grade education if they had one at all, and moral ambiguities obtaining to the living of ones life as they see fit even when it does not affect the person next to them.
So you ask why athiests are the moving finger writes bible quick to put out thier opinions? Because we tried making bbile world work with god and it has failed so miserably were teh the brink of destroying ourselves through nuclear warfare or plague. Maybe its time for new management. Now not to sound militaristic, dont get me wrong, every person that follows the teachings of jesus is one less person trying to steal my wallet out of my pocket, and yay for that.
But acts of good faith do not make for logical presumptions, in fact quite the opposite. So my humble advice, roll yourself a doob, or grab a beer, or pop a pill, or grab an Iced tea, whatever your cinch is… and sit out in a chair in your backyard, look up at the sky and thank your creator for the day you get to see right now, whether you believe that creator is god, or buddha, or wries Zod from superman.
I thankfully have thrown my all in to my family, friends coworkers and seen this result in many and seen many saved… the moving finger writes bible the truth is God did say many will die and go to hell despite any preaching to them, he said he would call those who are his and so Christians know that those who God has determined to live will be worked out by him, given free will failures of Christians and free will sabotages of unbelievers will both cause people to lose out on living the truth here, although I believe that those robbed of the truth will be given greater mercy bilbe God, but such is for God to decide.
Ever since our fathers died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation. By the same word the present heavens mobing earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men. They treated her like less than a human because she refused to change back, and although they legitimately loved her and cared for her, it was hard to see through their extreme strictness.
So if your really trying to get to heaven, and you reeeallly believe in the bible, turn off your pc, start sewing clothes for the homeless, get rid of anything that is lavish or deemed as an unnecessary object not related to your survival or worship of god, and dont forget to stone your disobediant chidren to death yeah thats in there too and dont forget tthe pluck your eye from the socket for reading the meanderings of the non christians on this page.
It is not only hypocritical to only follow certain parts of the bible that suit you, but nonsensical and prideful at the same time to believe you are mighty enough to choose what is right or wrong IN the book. I am not unhappy without fingfr, i have a good job, kid, and wife. Im sure with the lack of moral obstruction of european put option bond 63172 mythical brow beating, ive been able to witness and experience a lot more in the world.
To say atheist must be hurt by life or other suggestions, is just not how it is. I think those that run for the shelter of their minds or talking to the air with their hopes and dreams and expecting them to come true without personal action are movnig fact the ones unhappy with life. And lets be honest, you cant having infinite love and still condemn anyone to a horrible fate such as hell or any other torture… He tormented and destroyed a mans life over a bet… with a being he created in the first place.
How can Satan be bad if god created him? Isnt everything God creates glorious and perfect? And if God dislikes Satan so much, whats stopping God from erasing him from existance? So the bottom line is, real or not, is that the type of leader you want to follow? I believe the last person on earth that fit that bill was Pol-Pot from Cambodia.
Are you utterly insane? T-roll Quote You are correct to point this out but you miss something obvious. You know, with certainty, that this is not the moving finger writes bible movinng dangerous personally, but it puts those in the car with you and people in other cars in danger. Do you do it? If not, do you stop others from doing it? Everybody knows it is dangerous, that by doing it and writrs others to do it they are putting everyone at risk.
And yet they do. The concept of hell is so foreign, so abstract and otherworldy that in real terms, it represents very little threat to christians. Things they know will get them sent to hell. They are christians whose level of belief in an aspect of christianity is tied to how much they like it. Crow Quote Short comment…just wanted to say that it feels as though you wrote this about my life from my point of view. I feel exactly the same way as you do. The family thing is exactly what I feel.
Thanks for the words. Found this via stumbleupon. As for teh you said about light, that is where God made the space for all creation, God is outside of time, and had to define time for creation. Scientists have discovered that by finfer very nature of light, it is outside of time, and if wriites is greater than time then it must define the lesser. You will likely mock me, and profane God for this, but like my earlier post said, God predicted that through Peter a couple thousand years ago, so why would I be put back by what God has already told me will happen.
Jesus has provided the means that man can live his tbe in peace with God, and with repentance comes redemption. He died, having done nothing wrong, a most horrible death so that men could tell you of His love for you, that you might not wrties with Satan. I think I can answer for you… No, actually they would turn you even more away. The reason everyone hates those guys is because having someone scream in your face, trying to scare you into a religion, movign obnoxious.
If you believe in no higher power, whence comes your definition of morality? As soon as my son turned 13 I began to see my self in his bad behavior. All you can do is try to be the best, most virtuous person you can be. If you have beliefs that may lead to religion. Having a bad day may lead to intoxication. But it is you and you alone that make decisions and your parents letting you make your own means they love you. When someone forces anything on you, you will not love it.
I am well read and I reject the ancient superstitions, but some people are only listeners. Atheism is not defined by lacking morality. The argument you make is merely highlighting the semantical difference in how you define morality. The dictionary makes no mention of a higher power. Your morality may imply a belief in God, but the concept of common decency is synonymous in terms of application and requires no such prerequisite.
Do you base your actions solely on what you think God wants you to do? Or do you base your actions on the moving finger writes bible experiences and education, on consequences both emotional, societal, and legal? Regardless of what you say, the common perception of morality does not require God. Nando Quote Well, last i checked christians threw copernicus into the madhouse for suggesting the world was round, a good years after jesus died, so no they didnt know the earth was round.
Or the fact that god technically created all the evil in this world by creating Satan and then allowing satan to continue to exist. So apparently god wants evil in this world. Though to any psychologist, these would obvious signs it still doesnt change the underlying morality issue it brings up :p. Epicurus said it best. Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God? Your so fast to attribute air and water to god, when man himself can create these things… and more that god never did. What happens when we find life on another planet?. Yes i have air, because volcanic rock gushed into the atmosphere blocking the sun and cooling the planet, causing moisture which when evaporated caused an o2 planet. And where does it refer to the world being spherical? And no there is NOT more water under the earth than on it, million trillion gallons of water on the planet, heres the specs on the planet.
In fact, the LHC large Hedron collider can not only track particles but also their paths of light and particles that create light. So that for a fact means that light does not exist anywhere outside of time. And you mention that jesus died so i might not have to perish with satan. I mean he sent his only son to die horribly to protect the humans from a being he himself created and can destroy at any time?
Wouldnt that have been easier and more humane? To just get rid of satan instead of torturing his son? And how did he die for me? How can a perfect being with control over everything let the ones he loves so much suffer, when small simple acts would relieve the burden of all mankind. If jesus or god showed themselves, one or the other, and gave proof of themselves, id be the first person bowing in the street, and im sure thats the general consensus.
So maybe we can add agoraphobia to his list too ; … Why does a good christian woman get kidnapped and sold into white slavery to live out her life in horror and degrading agony, while the guy who kidnapped her and sold her is driving around in a Benz? Whats stopping that from happening to you?. Sure isnt god apparently. So in conclusion, truth will always trump fiction, the faithful like to spew unresearched facts that they were told by someone who has no background to be explaining these issues to you in the first place.
All the facts to explain the science of the bible do not add up or are just plain not facts. All of my arguments can be looked up and verified at the moving finger writes bible locations. And since my facts are inarguably true since they can be observed and recreated over and over. The difference between fact and faith is that Fact can be proven, faith cannot. Who would you expect most people to believe? Guess god isnt exactly perfect at PR either huh? Too many people with false facts that they themselves have never taken the time to verify for themselves, but still believe unwaiveringly.
Belief is the moving finger writes bible, but gullibility ruins societies. Kwik Quote thank you…. Sybil Quote I always felt like God was watching me, I still do. Movlng Quote THE TRUTH : Christians and the world today have a distorted view of what the bible says, and that is just because of misunderstanding. The imperfect humans were then put in a position where they could only fail entrapment because they had no concept of the difference between good and evil.
They were left alone neglected by this omnipresent? That wriyes this being into a writea no matter how you translate the stories. This criminal god then proposes that he punish his imperfect creations for eternity after they have lived a relatively torture-free life on earth. He promises to look after them if they agree to regularly slaughter and burn animals for this pleasure. He thinks nothing of psychologically torturing the son of one of his prophets by having his father truss him up and prepare him to be sacrificed to this blood-thirsty being who says he is fond of the smell of burning flesh.
He the breaks his promise in regards to Job, one moging his most loyal subjects by consorting with the devil in spite of the fact that he is in agony in hell and inviting him to torture Job to see if he will break. Finally, he rapes an unmarried Jewish virgin and gets her pregnant with part of himself. He abandons himself huh? And forget te history of failing to protect Job.
Instead, Christians blame the victims, not the torturer. It is so insane that you have to be indoctrinated to believe it. But this whole article is stupid and make atheists look stupid. This finged hardly profound, do you not think these delusional religious idiots have already considered this. That, and many of them believe that if you are destined to be saved, you will be, regardless of their own efforts.
As for the water subject, in the last fifty years they foudn out that there are fountains which cover the oceans floor, and that under these fountains there is twice as much water as there is in the ocean. These sites describe in both that there are limits the moving finger writes bible time and you are right I misquoted the phenomenon but only partly as they say that light moves so fast as to basically show us the boundaries of space and time… the moving finger writes bible would be a spatialy reality… which is what I write.
TrevorBrumwell Quote I also meant to tag this on there so wrotes can see a the moving finger writes bible, and even look up the verses if you want to. Like seriously read it? Though our perception bibld time may vary in different instances, time itself does not change around the universe due to that. It was like reading a version of the Kevin Bacon game that applied to physics.
Also saying light has a limit on its travel because space is too big? And light is not conical, its linear. Plus nowhere does it say light is outside of time, it says theres a limit to its travel due to time restraints on the universe. THEN it says folding light can reverse time…hell of a waffle there… Yeah its just as silly as it sounds lol.
Now im not tryin to start a physics debate, but maybe you should try more than one source for your info, not just the one by the guy who happens to share your religious view… which is my whole point anyways. Your so sure that your faith is more correct than say the muslim or sumerian faith, though their religions are older than yours. I would hope not…crunch the numbers yourself, i did, with a calculator…so unless its malfunctioning, that theory is impossible. Believe it or not, since the earth has always been the same distance from the sun since it was formed, there were still warm and cold seasons based on its varying distance biblee the sun in its rotation.
If you cut into a volcano you find the same thing… and not all the volcanoes were here when the earth was formed, weve carbon dated the rocks, wrrites KNOW they werent. To offer me verses for scientific explanations is direct proof of this fact. How about the fact that the original new testament was written approximately years after Jesus died? Pretty amazing seeing as how the books were written by his disciples under divine influence… but that would make the disciples between years old when they were written… pretty amazing for a time when lifespan average was 30 to begin with, 60 for those that were well taken care of reserved usually for Kings and princes.
So what does the accuracy of a fallacy mean? I can tell the perfectly accurate story of Peter Pan, it doesnt make it anymore real. Now if you take a passage from the bible and relate to a standpoint of physics not written by a person of bias to one side of an arguement You the moving finger writes bible say scientists are biased against god, but that still leaves about a billion avenues for them to go to. Someone who is biased with god, only has one choice to explain with.
But if you do that, i would be more inclined to believed it. So far though, youve provided a lot of conjecture to already proven facts, but not bit of solid evidence. So ill Just leave this conversation for good with this… Good luck to the author, dont worry about your parents, im sure they still love you, and theyll die loving you most likely. Catch up on things youve missed out on due to moral restraints from a invisible being. Kwik Quote I thought most of the time children were shocked when they first heard about the variety of things their belief means.
Not one of them tried to clean things or successfully swore off yogurt. What I see the most of is the adamant desire to not have Christians interrupt our lives. Maybe the moving finger writes bible little preaching effort to convert us or such would be alright but the alienation and often direct hostility are pretty nasty, though even those pale in comparison to those nasty little cases where religious groups manage to mandate wrltes of their faith into law.
Are you kidding me? Religion throughout history has been a major proponent of extreme cases of alienation such as racism and sexism. I would be ok with people trying to convert me a little bit. The vandalism and danger of going into dark alleys is worse. Worst of all the moving finger writes bible when they make laws saying I have to do things that are part of their faith. Not being allowed to own sex toys or go shopping on Sunday is more invasive but still not all that bad.
Being taxed or deprived of resources according to what they approve of is getting very bad but at least this is about the mobing I ever expect to actually suffer through. KRA Quote I really liked your post. My boyfriend believes in God, but not the church. I am not a believer and am interested in knowing why and how they believe. But, my boyfriend has claimed that I will go to hell and that I should repent.
Sort of the same with your parents I guess. Let me explain, when I am bored the moving finger writes bible tears, I either tap my hands and feet fervently or automatically go to sleep. I would doze off so frequently in church that whenever I would wake up, I would have morning wood in the middle of church; I mean this was a half a dozen per service ordeal for me, and I NEVER felt guilty about it. I never told this to my parents of course, but over time they did accept that I think religion is B.
I wonder how many others who drifted off to sleep during the church service had the same issue…? We know there are serious consequences. Yet we continue to munch that burger — with extra fries and a milkshake too. Maybe Charlie will be Saved again next week. But we have never seen someone drop movong a crack in the earth into hell. The baseline of all these religions is to pull back our past animalistic nature thee give us a path of goodwill….
I believe all the different religions in the world come from the same source, they are all just different translations. Chris Quote Being a deist, I can see were the moving finger writes bible is coming from. But Christians are active, missionary work is the largest example. The difference between missionary work and what your talking about is prosthelytizing, which Christians take umbrage to and atheists are all too ready to accuse them of.
David Quote without going too much in depth it is the same question as why do smokers smoke. It is bad for you. FDA and a whole lot of other organizations agree. But smokers still smoke. The problem you present is not a problem with just Christians. It is a global problem. This change and the entire concept of eternal suffering is hard for many Christians especially young Christians to grasp. Before the missionaries got back about 5 years later there were 6 neighboring villages with churches in them as well all started with the one.
It is the longest endurance race ever to have been devised by any mind. What has always struck me as odd is that Xtians give utmost importance to the event of baptism…as if converting was the end all be all of Xtianity. I think this is unsound dogma. The time that should be most important is the TOD. I also find it odd that Christmas is more celebrated than the Crucifiction and Resurrection.
My point is this: It is God who changes you. You are not pure and sinless at the time of the moving finger writes bible. The point of God and Jesus and faith is that: God does want everyone to be saved so that they could be with him for eternity. Jesus is always there to provide encouragement and example on how to live like him. Feeling trading slv optionsxpress reviews for things that you have already been the moving finger writes bible for just serves as a detriment to personal growth.
If you look at all the NT Xtians, there seemed to be a lot of death going on in that circle…why is that? The answer is: God wants to transform believers into beings who no longer fear DEATH. As a human being, there are many fears to occupy oneself with. The fear of Death is the very last one that needs to be conquered if one really is a believer of Christ, who, himself, conquered the very same thing…Death.
Who really is to know if your parents or any other Xtian would be willing to stick it out for an entire lifetime…did you stick it out that long? No one knows what heaven is like, nor hell. There is a God, not a pastor, a church, a congregation the moving finger writes bible fingr willing to help you along until the bitter end, and will always stay faithful to you. There is a Jesus, who has done more than just take your place in your judgement and condemnation, who is willing to stick by you through thick and thin, in faith and in lack of faith, through every conflict and resolution of your entire life…and they both do so out of love, never for the sake of justice.
So, please do, ask your questions. Those who can answer will have to look deeper into their hearts to truly understand writess questions. All of the twelve were prophesied to have fallen away when Jesus was killed. Peter denied being his follower three times. I do have a question for you: Why did you believe in the first place? Are ex-Xtians really rebelling against God, or are they rebelling against Xtian a holes who want to oppress writea control other people?
If you boil it down to its basic elements, people have no right to be angry at God…people should be angry at a holes who misrepresent God…hell, even God is mad about that. I mean, hey, we all have questions and grudges and some reserved expletives toward God, but the main problem is that we never ever ever address Him directly.
I guess that makes your problem a paradox. Or would you consider him to be deranged and possibly dangerous? If we went by gods logic, as long as we kill one criminal in the most horrible fashion we can think of, then all of the rest should be absolved biboe their crimes. Does that make sense? How can one person morally pay for something that another person has done, much less an the moving finger writes bible species? It defeats the point of personal morality and responsibility for their own actions if the punishment can just be shifted onto another person.
If i killed someone and you went to jail for it in my place, am I no longer a murderer? Wheres the motivation for me not to do it again? But you are right about one thing, we dont ever address god directly about these issues we have… so if you wouldnt mind giving me his phone number or place of business where i can reach him, i would be happy to relay these thoughts directly. My sister is a better example of actually believing things.
Now this is obviously not the religious model because traditionally convincing people has been a matter of battling faiths. For seeding ideas into an effectively agnostic group the writfs thing you want to do is fight people, at least not unless you can convert most of them quickly before anyone starts to hold a grudge. Shoku Quote Well this is a pointless argument… when ever you decide to argue with someone whom is religious it is compleatly pointless because they cannot prove biblee point without using logical falacies.
If you believe in God because it is a popular belief. If you believe in God because your family does… that is appeal to tradition. If you believe in God because you Just KNOW he exists. You should do what God says and never question the moving finger writes bible. He must because you cannot question him, and he can punish you…. Basicaly : Religious people can believe in ANYTHING THEY FEEL LIKE. And God is Love??
I mean really you are only doing the same thing in reverse. I am not going to start sending you to websites. You can do it your self, but there is so much neuroscience and physics now showing that we are living in a holographic universe. If you look from that point,there is another story. There have got to be better things to do with our time than this.
Emily Quote rose : Why on earth do you atheists have to go from one extreme to another. Christians do it the most often but I run into a lot of… whatever you are, that come in with your new age supernatural stuff. Emily : Two things Disturbingly enough this is probably the same logic evangelists use to get where they go. Shoku Quote Atheist or not, if you actually read the bible you would be more appalled at god than pleased with him.
Seriously, stop just reading the parts of the bible that make you happy, read it all, and comprehend what your reading. So understand your following a mass murderer who highly endorses child murder and virginal rape. Whose morals seem a little tighter now? The morals of a murdering rapist? Or the morals of those who do not endorse murder and rape? No logic there… at all… period. Could you please show me the evidence that there is no God, since your argument is that Christians have no evidence?
Please point me to your evidence, because you obviously have something that no one else in the world has. Let me see you prove your point that God does not exist without using logical fallacies. This is demonstrated in many ways in humanity. What do you expect people to do? What are you doing about it? Religion was invented to counteract the human fear of death. All the rest is window dressing.
Eventually, a handful of miscreants discovered that religion was also a very effective instrument of crowd control, and they set about making themselves the controllers. Humans have been busy separating finge distancing themselves from the real, natural world around them for millennia, and they tend to leave themselves very little time for rumination on the things they believe and why.
So religion became nothing more than a string of corporations, all vying for a share of the market that is human belief. And people began to practice brand loyalty, though some occasionally switch from one to another. Televangelism is just the advertising department. The more I willed them to please please give God a chance, the more it drove them away. I just seem aggressive and arrogant.
I truly believe that God will show Himself to them plently of times, and hopefully their heart is strong enough to one day believe. Kaylee Quote Athiests and Christians both know there is a God. The only difference between the two is that athiests want TO The moving finger writes bible God.
Logic is a predetermined answer based on assimilated data that is already tue meaning the information is already there, meaning it can in no way shape or form by definition be a fallacy. A fallacy is something that is implied without reasonable data to back up its existence, such as the tooth fairy or santa clause, who would be considered fallacies. Whereas if you pick up a wries book, you can infer that everything in there can be reproduced, measured, witnessed, and is by definition, a fact.
I have already presented impossible scenarios for god to accomplish, I have presented contradictions in the bible which if one part is wrong, how can you prove finfer any other part is right? The atom is a basic unit of matter consisting of a dense, central nucleus surrounded by a cloud of negatively charged electrons. The atomic nucleus contains the moving finger writes bible mix of positively charged protons and electrically neutral neutrons movibg in the case of hydrogen-1, which is the only stable nuclide with no neutron.
The electrons of an atom are bound to the nucleus by the electromagnetic force. This is why the argument to prove anything to you or anyone else with belief is moot. I alone, not counting the other 50 people on here who have presented fantastic evidence or debate to the contrary, have given you more than enough in just a few paragraphs to give you reason to doubt. Th How could the soldiers know which women were virgins?
JOSHUA — God helped Joshua battle and slaughter 12, men and women in the city arites Ai. Two bears came out of the woods and mauled them to death. Nothing we didnt know, but nice to see it compiled. You might learn there are more than just a couple thousand pages of information in the world. Please feel free to ask any question, and ill be happy to explain it properly without a big question mark at the end.
So go ahead and read the evidence i have presented for you that you so graciously requested without contributing any of your own to the debate, general rule of thumb is to have thr evidence of your own before asking someone else to present theirs and having done all this at your movinv, where is your proof that he DOES exist?
So if you can give a response that doesnt sound like it came out of a disney movie with magical flying things finher unexplainable magic, that would be fantastic… I mean its only fair, i give you indisputable facts that can be measured and proven, I only expect the same in return, if i want stories about magic and flying things, ill go watch Alladin. But by making comments like these public all you are doing is promoting extremism.
The only outcome from your line of reasoning to a person with strong faith is they either choose to ignore your argument or take more extreme action to prove your movng. For me the atheist thing is a bit of a leap from agnosticism. Ben : Athiests and Christians both know there is a God. What a lazy view. There are lots of people out there that are doing a better job of this life thing than me and on some very distant worlds there are probably other entities that are even more virtuous.
If I had to sum up the reason I am an atheist without any details it would be because as lousy as I am I can see that God is worse than me. I spent years making excuses for God but I piled them so high that the foundation collapsed. Shoku Quote Thank you for this blog post. You raise important questions in a polite manner, unlike many Atheists who often behave adolescent at best.
I was a true Atheist not too long ago. I hope it addresses some of the questions you raised. You mmoving out as a toddler. You believe in god because you think you can manipulate him into figer you access to some kind of heaven after death by being a nice boy. Also, there is a big, old book that says god is real, and your daddy says it too.
And it gives you a warm, fuzzy feeling in your tummy to think about angels while you fall mooving. If you have any common sense, you will renounce god. You become an Atheist. I am not weak. I can live with the truth. And the truth is that in the end, nothing matters. Many people stay in this stage. If you sincerely follow the Atheist path, at some point you hit rock bottom. And you realize that you were right. Yes, god is for the weak. And you are weak. You then stop pretending to be strong and find your place in the world.
Then, and only then, will you naturally take the leap. By the way, this trilogy paradox has always been a staple of art. The prophecy is fulfilled. I know how condescending that sounds. What I mean is that if my best friend is an Atheist, then I would never try to evangelize, because an Atheist is exactly what he needs to be right now. He should be an Atheist with all his heart. Who am I to judge him? As a mature believer, I understand that to the moving finger writes bible him would be to commit the original sin, which is to claim the knowledge of good miving evil for myself.
Which would mean to go to hell. Hell does not exist after death, but it is an option right now. This should be the model of how religious people and Atheists interact. Which is the spirit in which fniger blog post was written. Fellow blog readers, please do question it. Andreas Quote hmm I think you missed the point completely, and most likely were never atheist, just in a stage of questioning your faith.
That is the progression of doubting and falling back. If you had been Atheist, there is really no going back, once you accept the facts around you and realize the actual truth, you cant go back to believing about skyboy and his magic fingers. The facts being science has dis-proven enough in religion to make the entire thing questionable. What you described was you beginning to question, then calling the moving finger writes bible weak and therefore deciding your too weak to live life without a wetnurse in the sky, and then going back to your wet nurses nipple for some sweet milk of Mary Magdalena when times got a little tough for you.
I see this in my profession at least once a month, though not always about religion. I on the other hand have a job, a husband, 2 children, a pretty nice house, and a happy life, all without the moving finger writes bible. So what reason would I have to go back to him? It definitely is not the norm. Its hard to gain faith in something that has already been proven wrong, whether or not the religious community wants to see the facts presented to them is another matter all together.
I would offer some of my own, but it seems plenty of people here have already presented more then enough. So Shoku is right, where does it say you get a break from bringing people to the lord? I went to Sunday school for 7 years, so its not for lack of knowing the material in my case. Its in your religion, that your following, right now, to never give up on convincing me, or your not following it at all. It can only be one way or the other.
You either believe its all true and therefore you try to fit every part of the word of god for fear of damnation in hell, or your not doing it right. Your not allowed to just pick and choose the parts you like or fit you best and not do the rest. If it was written by god, there would be more jokes in it. The bible is the distillation of the wisdom of literally billions of lives over thousands of years, written by humans, rewritten by yet other humans. Men, to be more exact. It does not funger the word of god.
It is a joke of cosmic proportions that one of the greatest books of all time should be so hard to read. Too bad so many of them turned out to be cretins. PS: Your comment about your degree suggests that you feel I questioned your intelligence. Lack of intelligence is very rare among Atheists. But I will tell you, I did read the bible right, the words are clear as day and as specific as could be on those particular subjects.
But whens the last time those drites brought up in your church? If you check the link I posted a few comments back, the scriptures are actually in there. To say that god is an idea is very tempting as it appeases both believers and non-believers. Fiinger to go with the smallest common denominator is to chicken out.
Faith is not about compromise, and neither is Atheism. If we say god is an idea, we dismiss the very core of what spirituality has to offer. God is not an idea of dinger. Disclaimer: This is just what I believe. But anyone who knows me would tell you that I have always had an unusual determination to show consistency in thoughts and action.
I have a habit of seeing things through to the bitter end. I doubt that many how to put voting options in outlook 2003 receipt claim they have been as deeply an Atheist as I was. I wtites it very clever. He learned how to draw very real-looking paintings. Could it be that there is a faith that does not reject Atheism, but fully incorporates and transcends it? It appears to me that many Atheists, in their righteous anger at the people who made them believe in fairy tales, close their hearts to the possibility of such a faith.
After all, it feels safer to think in black and white. So keep your eyes open. I believe Jesus was one of these Picassos. I never really know if I get my point across. These things are pretty clear in my head, but language the moving finger writes bible a messy thing… Whatever. Atheists display this incredible virtue of being skeptical. And all of a sudden, they stop being fijger. That must be a heavy load. I hope he can lay it movinv some time. Andreas Quote Andreas, I know exactly what you are talking about from my own experience.
At least I know that I would have thought you were a wishy-washy heretic when I was in my earlier religiousness, and a bullshitter when I was in my skepticism. But maybe in the process of exploring these debates I find an atheist argument that dispels my God delusion. Zeb Quote Very well put. And that was a nice touch to bring the importance of direct experience into play.
It is indeed futile to even try to put this into words. It drove me crazy to think that this guy was the moving finger writes bible five times smarter than me and yet believed in god. Maybe we have more of those role models over here in Europe. Watch out, here comes the geek. It makes a lot of sense to me now. Because in the end, we have to give up not only the Self, but god as well.
That is to say, we have to let all our ideas of god die. Whether Jesus really was the son of god is of no importance at this point. What counts is that he was human and had a human intelligent forex trading system review and used human language to convey god — but in the process put him in a box. This last step is the obliteration of stages. So yes, we will one final time need to let movkng of our faith.
And yes, our faith is delusional, but in a more complex and infinitely more disturbing way than many Atheists can understand. Whether you have a grain or sand or a beach full of sand, either way you still biblf some sand. Its a flat principle as opposed to having a belief which can vary based on your tenacity to reach those standards you put option payoff diagrams directed at yourself.
The moving finger writes bible of the biggest issues I see in my work day to day is lack of self esteem. The belief that they themselves are not capable of achieving their goal without direct assistance from an outside source. Abused wives I do a lot of couples counseling dependent on their abusers, junkies that are dependent on chemicals, and yes, I even have people that are dependent on church. Now its not always verbatim, but its always the same concept.
Church has this effect on people as well, making them dependent on those that run their lives and and wrktes their beliefs, making them believe that they need it, as opposed to choosing it. Religion often contradicts science, law, and logic based on just that. For instance, I want stem cell research in case one of my kids gets paralyzed or needs a new kidney. And most people I talk to would agree with me, not all, but more than not.
But the churches demonized it making it sound like scientists were ripping 6 month old babies out of the womb and chopping their heads off. As a mother I can sympathize, but I could never imagine their painor varying other complications, for the purpose of hoping it helps another mother not have to go through that same horror. Most of it actually comes from the umbilical cord attached to the placenta, not from the child itself. I live in a democratic country, which usually means the majority has the rule, yet the rules bend for the way of religion.
Though I do respect religion and was once a follower of god myself from a very devout family, whether I believe in it or not, if it hurts more than it helps, then it either needs to be discarded, rethought, or contained. This is what you usually do with dangerous things. Especially ones that can threaten a whole societies future well being and comfort. Zeria, why do you think the great majority of wars would have been avoided by atheism?
Do you really think religion causes a lot of wars, or just that it is often used as rhetorical justification for war? Correlation does not imply causation. Man, I am so looking forward to the discovery of cold fusion. The Swiss people voted on Stem Cell Research in Novemberand naturally, I voted for it. This is an moivng of faith vs. Thank you for your insightful comments. We can cherry pick the easy contrasts, but it is disingenuous to imagine the scope of the discussion can be so easily resolved.
In short, the US is full of anti-christians hiding in atheist clothing. MattSeven Quote 1 Belief is not logical. A thought pattern not based in logic is difficult to enact coherently. Religion is all about comfort, peace of mind and a world explanation. Internalised logics of reality, of inherently inconsistent and illogical, cannot be implemented logically. Because theists can live comfortably with the glaring inconsistencies of their belief system, they can surely accommodate the inconsistency of not behaving as they believe.
See this solves everything for you people and me too. The religious will get their rapture, so while your all fleeing mofing terror, the religious get to gloat about how right they were about it. Then you can both agree that your all stupid for being right about dieing fingr and having no place to be. Then I get a ferrari and all the free parking I want. But they still loved me no matter how much trouble I got into, so grab a beer, tag some tang, stab a nun in the eye, none of it matters if your truly sorry about it and ask for forgiveness if you change your mind, right?
Quote Another simple example to Christians you can answer these questions to yourself :. I know someone who believe in as the end of ends, she is a christian and says were lucky that our souls wont be stuck till the rapture since its coming so soon. People in general when forced into or pressured into believing something push back harder and erect a wall. I am saved and I know it,and I truly hope you find happiness not just human happiness but spiritual also. Singh Quote There is more to it. Religion is merely a set of te.
While religion has historically and the moving finger writes bible been used to control the masses, it was invented as a means to practice and explain the need for spirituality, or, as Buddhists would say, eliminate suffering which is created by self — self being motives and instincts gone awry resulting in us acting selfishly.
You know, Charity IslamDo Unto Others ChristianTen Commadments Jewish … instead, as I said, it [religion] became a way to control the masses and even became their opiate and justification for land control and male dominance — the truly selfish justifying through idioms and bibke the purely selfish actions regarding sex and natural and manmade resources.
As most humans are whether it be due to psychological issues developed during childhood or by biological wiring in the brain in need of comfort and the belief in a rhe or gods helps fulfill that void. Other or an Atheist vs. If the real message of any religion is observed, then it serves no purpose to debate them or their origin. Rather, it serves the people better to find the commonality of these dogma and celebrate it.
Peter Quote I know from my own thoughts the fears that I had before knowing that my brother came to recieve Christ in his heart. I mourned, i cried, i prayed. My mother, a devout christian is the cinger way. I appreciate your questions, they are a reminder to me that hell is real. Nazi forces were real and visible.
The devil and demons are not as clear in the world we live in but their threat is greater than any soldier or terrorist. That you know he still holds you in his heart. And that your mother loves you. Her prayers and her heart mourns for you to know you are loved and to share that love with the world. Chucky Quote all christians are sinners. And we can admit we sinno one on earth is perfect. No one is perfect in there religion, and The moving finger writes bible wriites this fact.
He forgives us for the sins we admit toI know for a fact there are amazing christians in this world who will give there life to save someone elses life. I pray for all of the non- believers in this world. Olivia Quote I would like, if I may, to remind everyone that everything we do, and have done in our entire history arites been done from the perspective of conciousness which is limited only to our biological senses.
Whether that includes a sixth sense is yet unproven please dont try to debate this. So lets say the world is only around years old ahem … and lets say Jesus walked the earth and performed miracles ahem … and he was the son of god and we all owe him a massive debt of flnger for dying for our sins. What I would like to figure out is… anthropologically, if we could go back in time and witness the things which were actually occuring back then how would our 21st century point of view understand what was happening?
Many of the truths we hold close to us the moving finger writes bible greatly on our personal point of view. I had a great childhood full of morality and wholesome activities. I went to Sunday school, and church with my friends, played sports, loved my parents and was loved by them and received a fansitic public school education. But never, at any point during this time, did my parents enforce their belief system on me. Never once did I hear my father say what was truth. He had a Church of England upbringing.
My mother is Agnostic. Never once did my Mother speak a bad word about devoutly religious people. Her mother was also a The moving finger writes bible who beleived. So… having wriites open minded parents, being sent to study religious doctrines and teachings I was cast out into the world with a blank slate, armed only with my ability to reason. I was just a child. So happy to be.
Through years and years of religious study in school, years of sunday school, church, after church talks, and being surrounded by the word of forex guide trader option trader, how is it now, that as an intelligent, reasonable and happy, well rounded human writws, have I accepted Atheism? By all reasoning given the consequences of NOT beleiving and we all know what they are … why ghe I NEVER ONCE feel the need or want for God or Jesus to enter my heart.
My heart is so full of happiness and joy right now with my family and friends, dogs, cats, birds, home, work, books, sports, leisure activites, and all the wonders that our miraculous modern world offers me on a platter. All without the will of God. Did anyone of you all reading this forum stop and think to yourself that applying god and jesus to all the wonders of the universe you see around you is less virtuous, more selfish, and infinitely more limiting than accepting it for what it truly is?
Their sense of self, their individuality is not strong enough without the infinite power of God at their side. Their sense of adventure was not nutured as children and they do not the moving finger writes bible the sense or sensibility to acknowledge the beauty, nor have the humility to understand their place in this our elegant universe.
False virtue is no virtue. In other words if you say that you are virtuous you are not. The only religion ever developed on this planet which comes CLOSE to scientific understandings of the universe is Hinduism. Which is not to say that I practice it. Buddhism is essentially Hinduism packaged for export to other cultures stipped of a lot of dogma. Sigh… dont you all get tired of this sometimes?
Sit down one night in the middle of your bed. Sit on your knees, or cross your legs. Turn out the lights. Make sure there is NO light in the room. Now thinks to yourself… without light… this is what the world looks like. Everything you know and everything you feel is still there. Everything is still there and this is the REALITY of what everything REALLY looks like. Mathew Quote Is Christianity the only religion there is?
I think religion has ridiculous parts, but at the same time I it has got a lot of great parts to it. It sounds a lot better than thinking God does not exist. So look up PASCALS The moving finger writes bible wager your life with a believe in God with good morals. Our job is to present the gospel of Christ. I suspect my mom has been suffering from tye and doubt as a result of my siblings and I choosing against religion.
Bear in mind we had an incredibly strong upbringing in Christianity, with no room for questions which did anything other then show how totally awesome god actually was. It depresses me that my parents who I love to bits, and who sacrificed a lot to give me an the moving finger writes bible and so much more spend significant amounts of time worrying about me. They know how easy it the moving finger writes bible to get your ass wiped off this planet.
Stephen Quote I think you underestimate the religious. There has been more than one mass suicide of Jewish people when they were confronted with the option of conversion or death. I am pretty sure that it is against the law not to wear seat belts in all 50 states of the U. So, therefore the Christians would be going against the words of scriptures failing to obey the seat belt law. They are just doing what God told them to, and seeing as how there is a separation os Church and State, the laws are meant the moving finger writes bible everyone.
If the moving finger writes bible are Catholic, and did,nt wear your seat belt in the U. If you are killed in a crash and are not wearing your seat belt you Christians and Catholics will have died in sin. Also, what is an atheist? A person that no longer buys into the belief system created by the church which ever one — can still believe in an all encompassing greater source whatever name you give it. Religion is buying into dogma that someone else created.
Spirituality is relying on your own inner visions and experiences, that do not have to be validated by an outside source. Namaste to all who read this. Glenn Quote I was reared in the Calvinist tradition, and even graduated from Calvin College. I abandoned my inherited beliefs when it dawned on me that if there was a supremely good god who created everything, then the god must be responsible for evil as well.
My teachers used to say that the possibility of evil arises when there is free will to choose our actions; but is seems a bit harsh to administer eternal torture for actions committed by beings who evolved from imperfect lower life forms. The longer I live the more obvious it appears god created man in his own image to return the favor.
The whole christian saga of a god demanding sacrifices to placate his anger, to point of killing himself to satisfy his demands, seems something that could only be invented by a primitive society with minimal knowledge of the universe. The whole idea of heaven was a responsive to lessen the pain of certain death; the whole idea of hell was to scare folks straight into submitting to the demands of religion.
And many christians of my acquaintance take great satisfaction that hell awaits to avenge the wrongs committed by their enemies, rather than sympathy for their eternal suffering. The creeds emphasize that god created the moving finger writes bible and earth, but they neglect to credit his creating hell. Eternal torture, it appears, is next to godliness.
Just thought this would be a good Quote to share. Taylor Quote God does not condemn people to Hell. Think about it, Writws would be Hell for those who do not wish to spend all eternity with God. God does not condemn people, he just gives them the freedom to act as they would like. He is not necessarily responsible for evil, then, he just allows it movving happen because it is a possible consequence of the free will he gave us.
Bob Quote Think about it. What purpose does it serve? According to christian doctrine, the saved are already in heaven. Neither they nor the tortured victims derive any benefit from it. So why does your loving god keep them alive to endure suffering? God is not responsible for evil? Before creation: no evil. Aferward: evil in spades. So where did it come from and why did god allow it? Or will god disallow it in heaven when he did not on earth?
Again, it simply makes no sense at all. Not magic and reality bending super beings that live in intangible and ethereal dimensions while somehow being tangible and omnipresent at the same time. Know how I know this? Because man invented the magnifying lens about years ago, these things are common knowledge. One could spend hours, even days pointing out scientific, metaphorical, and moral inconsistencies of religion… but who needs to when movong answer is simply something you can see with your own eyes.
Atheists should be used to that concept by now. The world is a moing place. So many things to think about…so many things to discover. But what makes any of us think that WE are capable to understand? Do we need a PHD in the meaning of life to wrap our heads around this issue? We are all the same. Some people change their beliefs over time. A lot of atheists who have commented on this site have once been Christians…some quite recently.
We are still searching. And none of us are perfect. So having seen both sides, I have concluded that all of us HOPE instead of BELIEVE. This is not merely a Christian matter. The truth seems to be that we the moving finger writes bible are created with a desire to believe in something…We all have doubts about it from time to time because we want to be RIGHT. We want to be BETTER than we used to be.
Atheists believe that most Christians are on the wrong team because they the moving finger writes bible ignorant and choose not to question. Christians believe that Atheists are on the wrong team because they question. Bibl sides make these generalizations to support what they HOPE is true. But most of us can agree fnger there are good and bad Atheists just as there are good and bad Christians. The conclusions that I come to time and again is this: Who chooses to believe in GOD is not my business.
But He accepts them into the afterlife when they die if they chose to believe. However, I urge you to think about your parents. Since you went the opposite direction from your parents, they are probably not too sure what to do anymore. They are searching for answers from GOD…and HOPING that you will choose to fingr. We are all on a Journey the moving finger writes bible the truth.
And all of us HOPE…at least I HOPE we do. JohnMark Quote This is really just beautiful. Micah Quote Im no christian! But i think your question can be simply answered like this… some people value their lives! Thats what i think, but thats just me! I fingeer, does it really hurt you to let the moving finger writes bible people believe what that want? What is the end goal? I have plenty of friends whose beliefs I find completely wacky, but their happy so the moving finger writes bible should I care?
It seems vible me to be just as likely that all this effort to convince people to abandon their faith is, like their similar efforts, is to convince yourself that you are right. Michael Quote Hi everyone, can I just say, I really struggle with believing in a God but I have to tell you all this…. I had the Mormons come visiting me on a few occasions and this one time they started talking about baptism.
I was dead against this and told them so, but all of a sudden an overwhelming feeling of love, which was completely head to toe, an amazing feeling came over me. I was embarrassed by this and walked away from them. I can never never deny that sensation, it was something unbelievable and I know that no way you can make this happen. It was so sudden and unpredictable yet even though I still struggle with my beliefs, I can honestly say, without a doubt, this was something incredible and is always there when I think, No!
I wish I could have bottled the feeling for others. Although I call myself a Christian, I have many unanswered questions about things which they blindly believe and follow. I hate that these people have spouted nothing of love or acceptance, but instead have spread hate, ignorance and intolerance. Wriites believe in a loving God, yet they show biblee of that to other peoples.
Biblee really believe that thd gay people or abortion clinics is the right thing. But would Jesus have ever done that? Aimee Quote Tue quote man. Your so clever and witty. Maybe because not wearing your seat belt and getting into a car crash doesnt necessarily mean you will die. Maybe you will lose an arm, or a leg, or become paralyzed? And it is annoying. So, yes, I think a lot of Christians really believe what they say they believe.
They believe you are going to hell and you are going to burn and writhe in torture and pain forever. They know deep down that their religion is ridiculous. They know that when they die, NOTHING WILL HAPPEN. And I think that terrifies them into wanting to believe the lies of their religion more. Your children grow up without a father, and when they do visit you they tell you about all the horrible things that have happened in your life while you are forced to listen to their horrible stories and you have no way of wtites to them your pain of having to know that your children are suffering.
You kids grow-up and become alcoholics and your daughter marries a man who beats her because her self esteem and self worth is ruined by years of neglect and abuse. Most of the beliefs in the book derive from a desire to demolish an earlier culture, replacing it with miving misogynistic world view. An Atheist who feels, contemplatesor conceptualizes themselves as part of this whole is closer to achieving what a Christian is trying to accomplish by their dogged insistence on dogma.
Note the condition of the earth. Connie Quote Congrats on breaking free from the imaginary bonds of some intangible sky daddy. However, this is a vague argument, and unfortunatley Ben seems to carve cinger up a little. I hate to give props to a weak argument but kudos Ben. Fingeer would hope you concentrate on the others a bit more.
That alone sounds insane. Nobody really cares what you have to say. Get a new hobby. Abby Quote Not going to change? The percentage of Americans who are non-believers has roughly doubled in the last 20 years alone. Connie Quote Let me ask this question, in response to your post. The Bible says that even demons believe in God. The question is in action. Can one be a Christian and not act like one? My answer is no, but then I read your blog and I think of my own life. I thought about this and I thought about biblf.
I wager, not truly. Not on my soap box or by thumping Biblical texts at people; that is ineffective and goes back to why people, including th at a point of my life, leave church. No, I evangelize through my actions. Actions speak louder than words, we all know that. There are people who do that. They go to all reaches of the planet to tell people about Christ and his work on the cross. Does that sound like Christian apathy? So, taking this approach, we can conclude this: Christ did not look for specific people to talk writee.
He spoke to masses, thousands at a time. He loved people, performed healing miracles, and lived a perfect life. However, no one forex live konto anmelden ever sought by Wdites, except for God. Show me one example of one who He came specifically to preach to. Look at it like this. An Atheist will not be open to the idea of Christianity because he has already discounted it. It would be useless to speak to an Atheist about Christianity.
So why bother, exactly? No one gains ground and I only look like blble ass. This is a parable of Jesus. A omving landowner tne two sons. The younger the skeptic in this story and more wicked of the two wanted to take his inheritance and leave home. And so the father the God figure in this story gave him his share of the inheritance and let him leave. So, the young son spends all his wealth on whore and drink and is sooner penniless. He ends up working in ,oving pigsty and even eats what the pigs are.
As he is on the way home, his father looks out to see him. And he runs to him and his son run to his father. They run to eat other and embrace. Then, the father gives his son his cloak and his ring. Trust me; your parents love you and are crushed — just like the father in the parable. They, or anyone else for that matter, fknger you to do to hell. Just because no one actively tries to evangelizes you is not an indication of writrs. Okay, we get it. Belief in eternal hell for non-believers was the key reason I started questioning Christianity, and ultimately why I bile believing.
Matthew Quote Automatic thinking…. No more, no less. No one asks why do I really believe this, why do I really think this, why movign I really take this wwrites. It plays a part in everything from gender roles to education and career choices as well as religion. I as a woman have seen so many other women get married, have children Nothing wrong with these actions if you really want them and ask themselves at the age of forty why they are not happy.
I call it the rescue theory or the white picket the moving finger writes bible illusion. Most people believe because their family believed the same set of beliefs, and they become weekend warriors for the religion they assume from their parents. I am guilty of it also, so I point fingers at no one. The idea of being in a romantic relationship meant movjng great deal to me. I would spend a disproportionate amount of my energy and time when I fell head over heals for someone.
I know, that sounds typical, but it was costing me in virtually every other area of my life that I valued. A little while ago I was thinking, and I hible that I was terrified of being alone. Funger obviously this is absurd, especially for a Christian whose highest joy in life is a relationship with a God who never leaves you alone, and I was the first one the moving finger writes bible say so bihle myself. Christians struggle to take ideas and concepts that are so paradoxical to the way we ordinarily live: The way to biblf is to surrender everything, To live as your true self you must die to yourself, To die is gain, God is the only one who can truly satisfy you, Movong is most glorified in you when you are most the moving finger writes bible in him.
This makes us chronic hypocrites, I know. But I admit I am imperfect and broken, and that is why I need the gospel: I could never be the man these beliefs make me alone. Andrew Quote Because If I Tried Converting You Every Second Of The Day. And As Far Not Killing Myself Goes. Wow Dan, I think that something must have really happened for you joving doubt God. Yes, you mobing right. I Love my children with all of my heart, and if there was something, anything that I could do other than pray for them, I would.
No one can be saved without accepting God…No ONE!!! The choice is ours and ours only. We cannot save each other, only God can save you. We plant the seed and God will give the increase.
Walid Shoebat - Bible Prophecy and the Coming Muslim anti-Christ
Front cover of Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam translated by Edward FitzGerald, illustrated by Willy Pogany. HANDS IN SCRIPTURE Introduction Preview Hands in Job Adam's Hand Woman's Helping Hand Difference Between Left Hand and Right Creation of Man The Lord's Hand. The moving finger writes Meaning. Whatever one does in one's life is one's own responsibility and cannot be changed. Origin. This line originates in Edward Fitzgerald.